Using the 4 Tendencies in Coaching with Emily Field, RD

This week on The Less Stressed Life Podcast, we have the macros queen and four time return guest, Emily Field, a registered dietician who teaches a mindful macros approach. Emily is here to share how she uses a personality typing tool called The Four Tendencies in her practice.  Developed by Gretchen Rubin, The Four Tendencies is how someone responds to inner and outer expectations.  I'm curious, which tendency do you think you are? 

Check out these other episodes with Emily:

• Episode 42: Lose Weight Without Hunger
• Episode 123: How to Eat to Look Like You Work Out
• Episode 126: Can You Love Your Body & Still Want To Change It? 

KEY TAKEAWAYS:

• What are the Four Tendencies?
• What is an inner expectation?
• What is an outer expectation?
• Strengths & weaknesses of each tendency
• Can they change?
• How Emily uses them in her practice
• The Four Tendencies Quiz

ABOUT GUEST:
Emily Field is a Registered Dietitian who teaches a mindful macros approach to help women ditch nonsense food rules and depriving diet behaviors - for good. Her clients are finding it liberating to focus on how much they can do, instead of how much they weigh, when they fuel and support their body appropriately.

Emily's Macros Made Easy course
Custom Macro Calculation

WHERE TO FIND:
Website: https://emilyfieldrd.com/
Instagram: @emilyfieldrd
Podcast: Macros Made Easy

WHERE TO FIND CHRISTA:
Website: https://www.christabiegler.com/
Instagram: @anti.inflammatory.nutritionist
Leave a review, submit a questions for the podcast or take one of my quizzes here: https://www.christabiegler.com/links

TRANSCRIPT:

[00:00:00] Christa: Today I have. Return probably three time guests. Not really sure how many times you've been on the show, but it's been a while, so it's time to come back. Uh, today I have Emily Field, who's a registered dietician who teaches a mindful macros approach to help women ditch nonsense food rules and depriving diet.

[00:00:19] Christa: Behaviors for good. Her clients find it liberating to focus on how much they can do instead of how much they can weigh when they fuel and support their body appropriately. Today, we are not talking exactly about that. We're talking a roundabout way in a topic that really, I think just affects everyone.

[00:00:36] Christa: We're talking about a different kind of personality typing tool and how, um, she uses that in practice. So welcome, Emily. Thanks for having me, Krista. Yeah. All right. So story backstory, why are we talking about this topic? We got together last summer, it's now April. At the time of this recording, this will come out the fall, you know, in a couple months.

[00:00:56] Christa: So about a year later, getting around to this topic. We were all together. We were together with some other, um, colleagues and I don't know how we got on this topic, but you shared, I think one of the other women we were, that we were there with Maria Terry, who has been on the podcast and talked about.

[00:01:11] Christa: Whatever the topic was. You were talking about using the four tendencies with clients and I was like, Ooh, I just love this, right? Because I love Enneagram. That's my personality tool of choice. But yours maybe, possibly, apparently the four tendencies. So yes, let's get into it. Just give us the 1 0 1. What are the four?

[00:01:33] Christa: Okay. Where do these come from? So understand 

[00:01:36] Emily Field: that the four Tendencies is a typing tool, a personality typing tool, specifically around how someone, uh, responds to inner and outer expectations. So it's developed by a woman named Gretchen Rubin, who I am mildly obsessed with. She has several books and a podcast of her own.

[00:01:55] Emily Field: She's developed quizzes around this stuff, and it is incredibly fascinating to me. I love human behavior. I love human psychology. Why are some people able to change their health behavior maybe easier than others? Obviously, this comes up a lot in coaching. When you're working with people, you want to help them help themselves, and so with the four Tendencies framework, it essentially says, Why is it easier for some people to, you know, set a goal and follow through on it when they set it themselves?

[00:02:24] Emily Field: Or maybe if I help someone set a goal and they, and I hold them accountable to that goal, maybe it's easier for that type of person. So she developed this framework and it basically types people into four categories. And those four categories are upholders. Questioners, obligers and Rebels, and as a coach, I am able to give somebody a quiz and they can say, wow, I, this brings true for my life and it helps me coach them better.

[00:02:50] Emily Field: It helps me have better success with a client if I know how to talk to them, and I know how to use this framework with them through coaching. 

[00:02:58] Christa: So when did this all start for you? Uh, we'll go through each subtype, but when did this mm-hmm. Start and do you actually make them do the quiz? I, because in my intake form I'm like, which Enneagram are you?

[00:03:11] Christa: Or disc or whatever, if you want to share it. And some people do and some people don't. And then it's. It's nice for me to know cuz then I can under, when you said I like to, I don't know how you said it, but I'm gonna say it like this. I like to psychoanalyze people. I like to study. Yeah, I like to And that it's, and so I know we have some personality similarities and I wonder if any of those are at the core of this because I'm constantly studying myself and my family and my husband's family and my clients just like to understand human behavior.

[00:03:40] Christa: So I don't know if this is just some kind of cursive as, or it's actually, yeah. Very fun. But do you, do you have your clients actually fill out, is it an, is it required, do you make them fill out this quiz? 

[00:03:53] Emily Field: So when I was working one-on-one with clients, uh, you know, my practice has evolved over the last several years and one-on-one with clients.

[00:04:00] Emily Field: Absolutely. The Enneagram and the four tendencies quiz was a part of my onboarding process, and I learned that it was kind of an essential piece. Now I've stepped away from one-on-one work, and I do primarily group coaching work, and it does show up in one particular module. So I work, I work through eight modules across 16 weeks with these people.

[00:04:20] Emily Field: And the one module around habit and behavior change, we're really diving in deep with, uh, these two quizzes, the Enneagram and the Four Tendency. So yes, it, it is. Required, but I mean, I'm never gonna, I can't force anybody to do anything. I mean, as anyone knows in a coach client relationship, when, um, the more someone participates and the more someone does your pre-work or homework, or really dives into the education that you give them, the more they're gonna get outta coaching and the better their experience is gonna be.

[00:04:46] Emily Field: So yeah, I would, I would call it essential. And especially in my one-on-one work, it happened much earlier in the process and now, uh, it's just kind of like embedded within the whole program. My, my, uh, group coaching program, 

[00:04:58] Christa: I'm having a moment in time right now where I feel, I mean this is maybe just a duh, but it's just, you know, as we go through our own development journey.

[00:05:07] Christa: So I'm having a moment where I feel like our relationship with self, I. Pretty much affects our relationship with everybody else, which is basically the summary of our stress of our entire life. Right? Or happiness. Mm-hmm. And so this is just a version of this. And so I noticed that some people will resonate with different tools more than others.

[00:05:26] Christa: I'm sure you notice this too. People will say, I don't really feel like I fit in that, but I like this other thing. So anyway, if people aren't familiar with the four tendencies, let's walk through. Each of those, I'll take notes and then we'll summarize a little bit. And, uh, whatever you could help us, help us determine what we are, um, would be awesome too.

[00:05:44] Christa: Yes, 

[00:05:44] Emily Field: I'll give some examples. Yeah, so as, I'll probably submit this in the show notes, I want you to take the quiz for yourself. Whoever's listening, it will teach you all you probably already know, especially if I start describing them. But it can be a helpful tool if you are coach yourself to use with your clients.

[00:05:59] Emily Field: So let's talk about the four tendencies. Everybody's gonna land. More heavily in one of these categories, there might be essence in certain stressors that might push you into another uh, category, but for the most part, Gretchen Rubin, um, theorizes that we all have one dominant theme or one dominant tendency.

[00:06:18] Emily Field: And remember, this is not necessarily a personality traits like maybe Enneagram might be. This is how you respond to inner and outer expectation. So an example of that would be, you know, an inner expectation is like, Work, uh, like a New Year's resolution or you wanna start a habit that's like, um, coming from within.

[00:06:35] Emily Field: You really wanna start something, you know, an outer expectation might be work deadlines. You're answering a request from a friend. You're showing up to the gym because your trainer's set an appointment, something like that. So expectations can come from the outside and they can also come from the inside.

[00:06:49] Emily Field: A person who is an upholder readily responds to inner and outer expectations. They are sa, they are the people that are kings and queens of discipline. You might find the person who signs up for a marathon or a triathlon, they commit themselves to a training plan and they can follow through. There's really nothing that's.

[00:07:07] Emily Field: Really getting in the way of these people. Um, there's obviously downfalls to every single one of these. There's pros and cons to every single one of these. We can talk about that later. But upholders in general respond equally and strongly to inner and outer expectations. Questionnaires is the second one.

[00:07:22] Emily Field: Questionnaires question all expectations. They will meet an expectation, an inner or an outer expectation only if it makes sense to them. They have to really get bought in to that, the reason why, um, they are committing to something. Okay, obligers. Meet outer expectations, but they really struggle to meet the inner expectations they impose on themselves.

[00:07:46] Emily Field: So they're the kind of people that, like, you know, in a workspace or a work environment, you can count on them to get it done. They, if it's on their calendar, they will do it. If it's on a list, they will do it. But when it comes to them trying to motivate themselves to do something, it's tougher. All right.

[00:08:01] Emily Field: And the last tendency is rebels. And this is the person that resists all expectations, inner and outer alike. So it's difficult for them to make themselves do anything. It's difficult for others to motivate them or expect them to do things, and I would say in the bell curve of the population. Upholders and rebel.

[00:08:18] Emily Field: Uh, rebels are probably on the outside and questioners and obligers are more on the inside. So the inside of the bell curve, they probably makes up more of the population and those tail ends of the bell curve are more like those upholders and rebels. So let's dive in. What are your questions about any of these?

[00:08:35] Christa: Well, what I was doing as I took notes through all of these was profiling people I know in my brain as what they are, right? How can I not? Mm-hmm. So, um, up, and I also was thinking about how wonderful this tool would be from one of my clinician groups met recently, and we talked about using personality tools and hiring because that has been a.

[00:08:57] Christa: Very educational experience that if you have people that are too much like you, that may or may not work. And it, it can work for different reasons, but you must know pros and cons, right? And like where you might run into some barriers through that. So those are the things I was thinking through. Um, okay.

[00:09:12] Christa: So do you want to share some pros and cons? Like, I know when it's an audio, it's a little different than when, you know, someone can write this down. So feel free to go through them again and talk about the pros and cons of each a little bit, and then we'll dig into, Some of 'em a little bit more. 

[00:09:28] Emily Field: Okay, let's start at the top while we go in the same exact order.

[00:09:32] Emily Field: Upholders, like I said, they respond very easily to inner and outer expectations, internal and external expectations. So strengths. They are self-directed. They can meet deadlines. They work on projects. They can take initiative without much supervision. You might call this person a self-starter, self-motivated, they're reliable, they're thorough.

[00:09:56] Emily Field: Um, you know, eager to understand and meet expectations. So for this person, if I'm managing them or if I'm working with them in a coaching relationship, I might not have to tell them much. Um, I might give them their macro targets and they might, you know, I might give it before we even start working together, and they're on their way and they're hitting those targets now.

[00:10:17] Emily Field: They can also be rigid and offensive. They could be over scrupulous. They might, um, tend to be, um, critical of themselves when they can't meet expectations for whatever reason. If we're trying to help somebody change their health behavior, you know, there's a lot of potential barriers that can come along in the time that we work with them.

[00:10:35] Emily Field: And so if something doesn't go according to plan or travel or vacation, or things just go awry for whatever reason, they may have a tough time. Um, Adapting. Mm-hmm. So for this person might, uh, we might be working together. The reason why they've hired me is because they lack this, like, sense of freedom around their food or flexibility with their food.

[00:10:55] Emily Field: And so that's what we're really working on. Mm-hmm. Um, so you might type this person, you probably know this person in your mind. I don't. Know that I have a ton of upholders in my personal life, but I can certainly find them in the health space. Mm-hmm. Because they're the people that are like, I'm setting out on this goal and I am just gonna not stop until I achieve it.

[00:11:12] Emily Field: But let's just say if we're traveling with that same person, they're the one that's waking up at 6:00 AM to go for a run or to get their training in, or they're bringing their own food because they, um, want to, like, it's admirable, but sometimes can be viewed as inflexible. Do you see what I'm saying?

[00:11:29] Christa: Yeah, definitely a lot of clients, I would, I don't know if this is a good statement, but in any your grand world, a one is a, there's multiple ways to characterize each. Number one is one way to call it as perfectionist. They don't like to be called a perfectionist, um, but a reformer or someone who can, um, Improve things.

[00:11:48] Christa: Improve. Mm-hmm. I would say it's a little bit of a similarity almost, but I see, mm-hmm. There's so much perfectionist tendencies right in, in health and those who are seeking out this like higher level of improving health, right? Mm-hmm. So I think we see a lot of Right older, probably. Those 

[00:12:02] Emily Field: are really good.

[00:12:03] Emily Field: The most common. You know, it's interesting, I don't know if you find this in your practice, but when I do the anagram. And the four tendencies, the large majority of my clients land in Obligers, so we'll talk about why that is. Um, but the large majority of people from the engram tend to be the ones and the threes, so they are three, I think most aligns with questioner, but we can.

[00:12:25] Emily Field: Talk about if there is any similarities there, but what you're just describing is type one, um, I think type one and upholder definitely go together and, um, my most common client is a one or a three, and my most common client is like an obliger or questioner. So interesting to see that. Mm-hmm. 

[00:12:40] Christa: Yeah. I also think, I think we are possibly both questioners and I wonder if we mm-hmm.

[00:12:46] Christa: Attract, when you talk 

[00:12:47] Emily Field: attracter, 

[00:12:48] Christa: I, that's literally how I practice. Everything must make sense. I'm okay with anything if it makes sense. If it doesn't, don't just tell me to do something, to do it without a reason. And I've always, I mean, this literally was my life. It was like my parents telling me I couldn't go to prom as a freshman.

[00:13:05] Christa: I was like, Why that is stupid. I'm, yeah, I'm not going, no, 

[00:13:09] Emily Field: not going. We're the same. That, that's a great segue to talk about questioners. Questioners put, um, they question all expectations, inner and outer. They put a high value on reasoning research information. Um, they follow the advice of authority. If they believe in that authority.

[00:13:28] Emily Field: So, um, not necessarily, uh, letters after your name, but they truly believe in their messaging or they find that the, like the check marks have been, or the check the boxes have been checked on that person. However, their reasoning may be. So their strengths are that they are. Data driven. They are interested in creating systems that are efficient and effective.

[00:13:48] Emily Field: I don't know what describes me more. Like that statement is literally describes me as a business owner. Mm-hmm. Um, they're willing to play devil's advocate or fuck the system if warranted. And you could ask my partner, Brad, he calls me in all of our social situations, the devil's advocate. And I am only doing this as a thought exercise, not to be.

[00:14:07] Emily Field: A B I'm just doing it to, as a thought exercise. Like what if we looked at it at this angle? Or have you thought about that? Definitely. You're gonna hear that outta my mouth. I, they would be called, I say I because I identify so much with this, but you know, strong-willed would be a word to describe. Now possible weaknesses, which I also identify with and have learned to work with, is that they can suffer from an analysis paralysis.

[00:14:31] Emily Field: There's so much information that they're unable to make a decision. Um, they are impatient with what they see as others, maybe complacency. They, um, defy expectations that others find fair, or at least not optional. Such as like traffic regulations. You were saying like about your parents with prom, it's like.

[00:14:49] Emily Field: It just doesn't even see that. Doesn't seem, what's the point? It just seems stupid. What's the point? Mm-hmm. So they may resist answering other people's questions. So you can see, and I want to say that about all of these tendencies, you're, this is a tendency, this is how you tend to act. And if we know this about ourselves, we can maybe work with.

[00:15:07] Emily Field: Our strengths and, um, work to poke at our weaknesses. So you're not locked into this, just like the engram under times of stress, you might ex, uh, exhibit some qualities and under times of not stress, you exhibit much better qualities. The same, I think, goes here too. Mm-hmm. Um, for myself with a questionnaire, my major weakness.

[00:15:27] Emily Field: Really was in college and through the dietetic internship to become a dietician analysis paralysis was my weak point because I had unlimited information with the internet. And, um, I just think that I got myself into a place where I, I couldn't consume enough and I was paralyzed to make any decision.

[00:15:44] Emily Field: And the same thing goes with I think my clients. Um, and the reason why I ended up hiring health professionals in the. In the past, I can't direct my own plan because I can't see the forest through the trees, so I ne decided that I needed to. Find an expert that I trusted to take that decision making away from me, and now my life has opened up as a result.

[00:16:04] Emily Field: So not only in my health, but even as something as small as like decorating my office or my master bedroom, I had hundreds of Tads open because I couldn't figure out what to do about the bed or the curtains or the decor or whatever. But if I offload that onto somebody that I trust, they make the decisions for me.

[00:16:21] Emily Field: I press purchase and my life is so much better because all those decisions have been made. 

[00:16:26] Christa: What I hear is the desire to have efficiency, uh, plays through, and that's one of my core values. You know, I, I just think it's, let me give you a stupid example. When someone, when my husband asked me to ask someone else something, I'm like, why would you do that?

[00:16:45] Christa: Why would you just not go to that person? But from analysis paralysis, just even silly little things I have figured out. Like if I am going out to eat and the menu is so awesome, I just need to go with the first gut instinct. So my mm-hmm. So I'm not disappointed by this. Like, there are just two. I can, I can ask questions all day long.

[00:17:04] Christa: Does questioner have anything to do? I mean, Like, that's such an easy way to say, like, I ask a lot of questions. I'm questioning it so often, whereas I feel like with some of these other ones, I don't know, I dunno if that makes sense. I'm, I'm trying to say, It's almost obvious, um, that we would be questioners if we are questioning everything.

[00:17:24] Christa: Right. I don't know if I'm making mm-hmm. Sense there. But anyway. Um, 

[00:17:28] Emily Field: well, what's in, what's important for us to understand as coaches is that we tend to view the world before we do these kinds of personality quizzes. We tend to view the world, how we view the world. So, you know, you, you know, in our early relationships, let's just say I didn't know anybody was different.

[00:17:44] Emily Field: I didn't know anybody else. Like didn't question. I didn't know that that wasn't a plague for other people. So just taking the quiz could just be so insightful to realize that oh yeah, everyone's different. And the reason why this doesn't plague my friends is because they're not wired this way, and that's beautiful.

[00:18:00] Christa: Yes, I can understand why these are our clients because we both attract them. And also if you're looking for something efficient or if you, as you said, I had the whole world in front of me and I could have done all these things. If you're trying to do all the things, at some point you're gonna end up with this analysis paralysis and you must just kind of hand it off.

[00:18:18] Christa: So that makes sense, right? Mm-hmm. 

[00:18:20] Emily Field: Yeah. They're delegating to somebody they find to be trustworthy and get to their answers efficiently. So I, I think that's also why I landed in macros in that. Arena because it just makes sense to me. It just makes sense. The reasoning, the efficiency affected effectiveness of macros just makes sense to me.

[00:18:38] Emily Field: And so the people that love that approach are coming to me. It works out. It's a beautiful relationship. Mm-hmm. All right. Let's move on to Obliger. Obligers is a reminder are people who readily meet outer expectations or external expectations, but struggle to meet their own inner or internal expectations.

[00:18:55] Emily Field: So they put very high value on meeting commitments. To others, they'll do anything for a client, a patient, a family member. They love deadlines. They thrive with oversight, maybe monitoring or other forms of accountability. So in that vein, their strengths are that they are reliable, they're responsible.

[00:19:13] Emily Field: They can be count on as a team player, a good boss. A responsive leader, highly committed, willing to go the extra mile. Great employees. That's what we see through obligers. Possible weaknesses, however, and this is where they land for people in my client base, I would say they can become resentful about what's being asked of them.

[00:19:33] Emily Field: They're putting other people's needs in front of their own. So that is a form of stress. Um, they are exploitable. Um, they may show some destructive pattern of obliger rebellion. So if somebody's asking you to do something, you're just gonna just. Dig your heels in and say no. And that can be a total power struggle and a reciprocal relationship.

[00:19:54] Emily Field: They, um, need outer accountability to meet inner expectations. So, for example, I wanna lose weight or I want to start exercising. They wanna do something for themselves as internally motivated, but they can't seem to get themselves to do it. So it can be frustrating that they need to add some outer accountability or an outer expectation in order to make themselves do it.

[00:20:13] Emily Field: They hire a trainer. They hire a dietician, they have a check-in process, that sort of thing. So that can, that can be extra work for a obliger and it can be frustrating. So again, wanna talk about the. Strengths and weaknesses of these, of all of these tendencies. It's not necessarily a bad or a good thing, it's just kind of how you're wired.

[00:20:32] Emily Field: Mm-hmm. I'm 

[00:20:32] Christa: surprised that we don't have maybe more obligers. I think you said you have more upholders and questioners. Mm-hmm. I'm surprised we don't have more obligers. 

[00:20:40] Emily Field: I, no, I said more obligers and questioners. Obligers are very, it's very common for them to hire a coach cause they wish they could get themselves to follow macros.

[00:20:48] Emily Field: They wish they could get themselves to follow through on these things, but they've decided that offloading or having accountability that we off. For it through coaching is worth their worth, their 

[00:20:57] Christa: time. Mm-hmm. Something that came up in my brain when you were describing these was some feedback I've gotten from people.

[00:21:03] Christa: So the way I I do my programming or coaching is come and take what you need. We have a little bit of everything. You can get one-on-one, you can get group coaching, et cetera. Like you can, you can access me all the time if you want to on a weekly basis. And the people who maybe, maybe are in Obligers sometimes they kind of get a little bit of, they're like, I'm not going to participate in certain pieces of that because I find it overwhelming that I could do so many different things.

[00:21:33] Christa: Um, or I don't wanna have to show up to do all the stuff, if that makes sense. I can see where that could fall into questioning or obligers, but um, there's just some comments some people have made that say, you know, I just need to focus on the thing I've got and meet with you. And or meet with, meet with my practitioner and I'm good to go.

[00:21:49] Christa: Right. So that's kinda how I see that popping up. Um, is there anything different that you do with an obliger than maybe, like in me, to me, questioner makes so much sense. I would want them to understand what they're doing right. And that's, I tend to project that a ton as a questioner. But when you're working with an obliger, what are some of the, is there anything you do differently once you find out these tendencies?

[00:22:13] Christa: Out of curiosity, since you have a lot of questioners and obligers. 

[00:22:17] Emily Field: So I'd say for an obliger, once I find out, I either probably can ping them right away because I've been doing this long enough. Um, but I would say that for an obliger I might spend less time explaining why we're doing things. Mm-hmm. Um, whereas a questionnaire needs to have the reasoning.

[00:22:33] Emily Field: So if we're adjusting macros or I'm asking them to ditch one type of exercise in favor of another, I've gotta be very clear about why I might need to provide. More resources or more reading, maybe podcast episodes, things like that, so they can really internalize why I'm doing that. For an obliger, I might use better language in my check-in process and say, I challenge you this week.

[00:22:58] Emily Field: To get X amount of workouts or I challenge you this week to get one more, um, vegetable serving per day or something like that. And so they will rise to the occasion because they know that I'm gonna check up on them the next time we check in. So I might not need to use that language. There's a self, the self-starter and the upholders and the questionnaires, they already, uh, bought into the thing and so they're gonna follow through on their own, but maybe in obliger they just need to be outright told.

[00:23:23] Emily Field: They need to be. Asked to schedule, they need to be, maybe the idea of working out with a friend or, um, you know, meeting with a trainer would actually help them be more successful since we are in a digital and online relationship and I can't be there with them. Maybe those kinds of suggestions would resonate much better and they'd be much more successful, um, if I use that language.

[00:23:44] Christa: Mm. I wonder if they might need a tap on the shoulder if they haven't checked in on their own here or there too. 

[00:23:49] Emily Field: Oh, yeah. And that we have built those systems in too. Yeah, for sure. If you don't hear from someone after a couple weeks, like I'm definitely knocking on your internet door. Your online door.

[00:23:58] Emily Field: Yeah. Email or chat or something like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, yeah, I mean those are, those are the main differences. Questioners, I probably have to do a little bit more work, uh, to. Get them maybe bought into something that they, by the time they hire me, chances are they are already bought into a macros approach.

[00:24:16] Emily Field: They may not necessarily be bought into like eating more or changing their exercise. So I gotta beef up that reasoning and justify why I think we should go this way. And um, that usually works. For them. 

[00:24:28] Christa: Another way that I might see this playing out is if you have a menu of things that you teach people on the backend, right?

[00:24:35] Christa: Some are videos cuz you wanna make sure you've got foundations down. Maybe oblig, maybe questionnaires need to watch those. Whereas some of these other types don't always need to. Right. They don't need to know. Mm-hmm. The rationale, which is good to think about because in the efficiency it's a, it's a challenge between, I wanna tell you all these things, but I also wanna make this efficient and not make it more work for you to do that.

[00:24:57] Christa: So I 

[00:24:58] Emily Field: will say that, you know, obviously it's benefited me to be a questionnaire because I end up providing maybe more. Than what's necessary. So at least the information is there. But sometimes you and I could probably get caught up in details that don't actually matter for our clients. So while we think it's cool and important and we wanna share it, you know, this is the plight of like most professionals, cuz this is our obsession.

[00:25:19] Emily Field: Like this work is, you know, our passion, but that's not necessarily true for our clients. They just wanna feel better. So like, how do we get them to feel better without overwhelming them with all the information we think is cool? So that is a lesson that has been learned over 10 years of working with humans.

[00:25:35] Emily Field: So, 

[00:25:35] Christa: yeah. No kidding. Um, all right, cool Rebels. 

[00:25:39] Emily Field: The last one is Rebel, and I would say I've probably had two in my entire time coaching. They are fun, but very challenging to work with this as a reminder, uh, this person is, it's tough to respond to inner and outer expectations. They put a high value on freedom of choice, um, self-expression, authenticity.

[00:25:59] Emily Field: If someone asks or tells 'em to do something, they're likely to resist. And so because of that, they, uh, might feel like this, watch me, or I'm gonna do what I can wanna do, kind of attitude. Um, you're not the boss of me. You can't make me. That's kind of like the internal struggle. So their strengths tend to be that they're very independent minded.

[00:26:18] Emily Field: They're able to think outside the box. They are unswayed by a conventional opinion. They're in touch with their authentic selves and desires like that is really cool. That is awesome to watch in a rebel. But at the same time, they can be, they can appear as resistant or struggle with like mandatory tasks or repetitive tasks.

[00:26:38] Emily Field: They can sometimes think that the rules don't apply to them. Mm-hmm. Um, they repel, uh, routine and planning, which if you can imagine with nutrition, We are the product. Our health is the product of what you do most often. And so even though somebody might want to get to a new place, they want to change how they feel, look or perform.

[00:26:59] Emily Field: A lot of times that revolves around routine and they can't get themselves to commit to that routine. So in my experience with working with Rebels, it's. We have, we tend to gamify, uh, our coaching. So, um, we have to constantly tie back what we're doing today to our bigger goal. Have to constantly remind ourselves that what we're doing today or what we're doing in this week is related to my bigger, longer term goal.

[00:27:24] Emily Field: And. That in of itself can be challenging on your own. But as a, as a coach, it's, it is about, it's gamifying, it's constant reminders. It's, uh, switching up what you feel like doing during the day. You know, I don't know. I, I guess those are the strategies that I've used with my two re rebel clients. 

[00:27:42] Christa: Hmm. I. Uh, this is, this could be wrong.

[00:27:46] Christa: I just automatically feel like this is my second child, which other parents listening to this might feel this way about other kids and it may not be accurate or not, but she's quite rebellious. But it's also funny cuz when you brought up, I. Rules don't apply or, or essentially like I'm really unique is kind of maybe, possibly an expression, right?

[00:28:06] Christa: Mm-hmm. I'm, I'm, I might be putting that in the mouth there unintentionally, but that might remind me a little bit of an Enneagram four. I cannot remember what we call them, but they kind of are. Extra unique. They think someone's maybe not a little bit like them. What really, um, piqued my ears right there was when we think the rules don't apply to us or we're just kind of unique, that's an interesting thing to have to try to be a little bit creative with, right?

[00:28:30] Christa: Mm-hmm. Because it's like, mm-hmm hmm. But yes, biology, it does actually mm-hmm. Apply. So that one, that one I can understand. Good thing it's in the periphery, but also would you say that this would be the most challenging, um, person to coach? 

[00:28:46] Emily Field: It, it can tend to be the most challenging because I, if you imagine, um, a macro's approach is pretty repetitive.

[00:28:52] Emily Field: You're trying to hit your macro targets by the end of the day, you're committed to maybe some macro targets across a whole week for several months. So that can be very repetitive. Um, however, there are ways around that we can give people some flexibility in their macros, you know, up and down by a certain number of grams or percentage of calories.

[00:29:13] Emily Field: You know, incorporating new and novel foods can be a really helpful strategy. But what really works for rebels is what you said about your second child. They believe that identity is the most important. Like themselves, their authenticity is the most important thing. So if we can tie whatever habit or behavior change we want them to do, back to their expression of their best self, that is a very successful way to work with rebels.

[00:29:38] Emily Field: So they're gonna place really great value to be true to themselves. Maybe you're offering. Four suggestions about how to do that on any given day. And they can pick from that schorge board what, uh, strategy they're gonna use for themselves. I'm either going to take a walk or I'm going to strength train, or I'm gonna ride my Peloton, or I'm gonna work out with a friend.

[00:29:57] Emily Field: Whatever feels true to me today, at least I'm getting some movement. Like that would be an example. Mm-hmm. 

[00:30:02] Christa: That's a great example. I love it. Okay, so I don't know if I asked this already. Do these tendencies change for people? Do you know this? 

[00:30:13] Emily Field: Well, Gretchen Rubin says it typically don't change, and I'm gonna take her word for it because she invented it.

[00:30:18] Emily Field: Um, I haven't necessarily seen them change for my clients, whereas the end agram, I have seen change depend on, depending on like times of stress, also life change and like life transition. I've noticed people will say, I used to be this, but I don't know where I am now because. You know, they're going through a divorce or they have moved or they change a huge job change.

[00:30:39] Emily Field: Something like that can really stir up some stuff. Maybe it becomes less, uh, obvious, but as far as I know, the tendencies don't typically change. 

[00:30:46] Christa: Mm-hmm. When I grow up someday I'd like to do more engram study and certification. And it's funny because they say ENGRAM is not supposed to change, but whatever.

[00:30:55] Christa: We're not, we do not need to turn the coins on this one at all. Yeah. So is this, when you present this to people, when they, when they do these quizzes, when they kind of dig in, is it new to them? How do they respond? Knowing themselves, what are some of the, what is the feedback that you get from your clients when, um, they understand this about themselves?

[00:31:14] Christa: Well, 

[00:31:14] Emily Field: first of all, the four tendencies quiz is a lot shorter than Enneagram. So a lot of them are familiar with Enneagram. Not a lot have heard about the four tendencies, so this is usually new for them. They're excited that it's a quick quiz and they're excited that it, um, definitely explains a lot of their behavior, um, or the way that they've responded in work relationships or family relationships or parent-child relationships.

[00:31:36] Emily Field: So that feels good. It feels good to have an answer, right? So, um, and then also because they want to. Do well in our coaching relationship. This is directly reflective of a coach client, you know, inner outer expectation sort of thing. Um, versus Enneagram is personality. So it's tough to sometimes, um, you know, extrapolate that towards like health changes and things like that, or coach, client client relationship.

[00:32:01] Christa: Mm-hmm. Yeah, it makes a ton of sense. I feel like you would really want to understand if you're digging in and trying to accomplish things, you're gonna kind of want to know how you tick and how you would respond to these things. 

[00:32:15] Emily Field: Mm-hmm. Okay. I highly recommend, you know, if anybody wants more of this, you know, not only read the Four Tendencies book, um, visit the Gretchen Rubin's website.

[00:32:25] Emily Field: She has a ton of blogs and articles that re really dig into this, but better than before. And the four Tendencies book really shaped my coaching practice early on, and I know that I'm still using a lot of this stuff to this day, even though I've been coaching for close to 10 years now. 

[00:32:40] Christa: Hmm, that's super fun.

[00:32:41] Christa: Okay, so we covered a lot. We covered what they were, um, dug into the, the quick overview as well as the deep overview of each, kinda the pros and cons and weaknesses in them. We kind of really interlaced in between there how you've seen this play out in coaching. I offered any, my insights. Do you think we missed anything?

[00:32:58] Christa: Big picture about those four tendencies and how you use them in practice and how they're helpful for you in this coaching relationship and also in your life. 

[00:33:08] Emily Field: I don't think so. I think we really did a good job covering all those. We talked about what we are and how that can be a blind spot if we are not aware of what other people might be.

[00:33:18] Emily Field: So it's, I think as, as coaches might be listening or practitioner practitioners might be listening, it's important to know your own in order for you not to be blinded by who's coming in and outta your life. 

[00:33:27] Christa: Yeah. I also think it's just cool to think about things like this in the toolbox because our education is a bit, um, Salt and pepper.

[00:33:37] Christa: Like, it's just pretty straightforward. It's just very like in a box, right? Mm-hmm. And there's not a lot of this. There is a lot of health and emotion and behavior and tendencies and habits and patterns and subconscious programming that affects our success in our health sphere. And so these things have to cross over, but we're pretty ill informed.

[00:33:55] Christa: At least when we were, I felt when we were going to school, we didn't get a ton of this. So it's cool that you said, I'm, I'm just going to add this tool, my toolbox, and it's really, really helpful. So speaking of your toolbox, um, if this is the first time someone's heard you on the podcast because they love, uh, personality type things and they went after this one, tell us a little bit about what you do, what you're doing right now and what you're excited about.

[00:34:20] Emily Field: Well, um, like you said early on, I am a registered dietician. I own a online practice, and so, uh, I have offer a lot of different things. So my approach is a macros approach, which essentially means that you're going to be looking at the protein, the fat, and the carbohydrate content of our food in order to achieve whatever goal you want.

[00:34:38] Emily Field: So for some people that might be to look differently, body shape and size, it's really important to them. For others, it might be how they perform in their workouts or in their sport of choice. Um, you know, for others it might be be con controlling some sort of like, um, glucose or insulin issue, some hormone issue in that way.

[00:34:56] Emily Field: So we can really, essentially use food, uh, and macros to gently direct what we want our body to. Look, feel and perform like how they wanna look, feel, and perform. And I use macros in nearly every of one of my offerings. So I do offer coaching. Um, so we'd be in a, in a relationship for an extended period of time, and you'll get all this meat and potatoes that we talked about here today.

[00:35:17] Emily Field: I also have a, uh, macros course called Macros Made Easy. So that would be a DIY course to teach you how to track macros, if that's, Your alley. And then lastly, I have a D I Y guide to figure out your own macro, so we can link that in the show notes as well. So little bit of everything, but essentially in the realm of macro tracking and really health behavior change because that's so important to me too.

[00:35:40] Emily Field: And where can people find 

[00:35:41] Christa: you online? 

[00:35:43] Emily Field: So I'm at emily field rd.com. Um, I hang out on Instagram at the same handle, Emily Field Rd. And I just started my own podcast. So if this is something that interests you and you wanna hear me talk a little bit more extensively about macros, you can go to macros Made Easy with Emily Field Rd on any of those podcasts.

[00:36:01] Emily Field: Uh, what do we call those? Host podcast hosts? Mm-hmm. 

[00:36:06] Christa: Uh, I always feel like macros, and you and I've talked extensively about this, but when we were going to school, we did not talk about this at all, and it's a pretty underrated tool for the, uh, clinician or mm-hmm. Dietician's toolbox. So I appreciate the work that you do.

[00:36:19] Christa: I always think like you're the macros queen for sure. 

[00:36:23] Emily Field: Thank you. I accept that title. I even, I had an interview with somebody from Wall Street Journal who's writing a book about this, and she's like, who do I what diet, who, which dietician should I talk to about macros? Like, who would you call the expert?

[00:36:36] Emily Field: And I was like, you're talking to her. It's me. Fully own that. 

[00:36:40] Christa: Yeah, it's very cool. All right. Thanks so much for coming on today. Thank you.